'A' note Tuning Range

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'A' note Tuning Range

Will Godfrey
Currently in 'Scales' Yoshimi can set this anywhere between 1Hz and 2kHz, which
is frankly ridiculous.

This doesn't appear at all in the Scala documentation, so that's no guide.

I've had suggestions ranging from +- 1/2 semitone to +- half octave as being
more than enough, considering that there is also semitone master key shift
covering +- 3 octaves (used to be 5!) along with a fine detune of +63 -64
cents.

What have other synth people here set for this? Does anyone else actually have
the setting?

--
Will J Godfrey
http://www.musically.me.uk
Say you have a poem and I have a tune.
Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.
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Re: 'A' note Tuning Range

Jeanette C.
Apr 9 2019, Will Godfrey has written:
...
> What have other synth people here set for this? Does anyone else actually have
> the setting?
...
Not that I write a synth, as well you know. :) In some synths I've seen
it fixed to certain values, related to old tunings. +/- 1/2 octave seems
generous. I've mostly seen that used in relation to orchestral
instruments and - of course - organs.

In practise, the lowest value for A I know of is 392, but I think
someone mentioned that there is even a slightly lower value than that
going to (almost) f. Upwards, I only know of 441/442Hz as "American
concert pitch".

Not being a guru of any description, permit for a slightly wider range.
:)

Aside: that might be a lovely combination, a concert for harpsichord,
ceelo and Yoshimi.

Best wishes,

jeanny

--
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Re: 'A' note Tuning Range

linux
In reply to this post by Will Godfrey
Without doubts it should be 440 Hz +- 50 Cent.

+- 50 Cents is what the meter of the BOSS TU-12H chromatic tuner
displays and what you'll find for other software synth, such as e.g.
iSymphonic. The BOSS meter's Hz labelling is from 430 Hz to 450 Hz and
the Hz labelling of iSymphonic from 428 Hz to 452 Hz. IOW the
Cent labelling range from - 50 Cent to + 50 Cent is a little bit more
than the HZ labelling range from 428 Hz or 430 Hz to 450 Hz or 452 Hz.
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Re: 'A' note Tuning Range

linux
In reply to this post by Will Godfrey
PS:

+-50 Cent makes sense, since it's half of a semitone interval, see
the Information taken from
http://www.sengpielaudio.com/calculator-centsratio.htm:

Interval                Frequency ratio    cents
Semitone or minor second 1.059463 : 1   100

Here's a Table of Cents Difference for some frequencies close around
440 Hz:
Frequency Difference
435 Hz        −19.78 cents
436 Hz        −15.81 cents
437 Hz        −11.84 cents
438 Hz        −7.89 cents
439 Hz        −3.94 cents
440 Hz        ±0 cent
441 Hz        +3.93 cents
442 Hz        +7.85 cents
443 Hz        +11.76 cents
444 Hz        +15.67 cents
445 Hz        +19.56 cents
 
So, the conversion factor 4 cents / Hz is valid for the purposes of
tuning as an exception only very close around 440 Hz. There is no
conversion from Hz to cents and vice versa. Statement: Cent is a
logarithmic unit of measure of an interval, and that is a dimensionless
"frequency ratio" of f2 / f1.
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Re: 'A' note Tuning Range

Will Godfrey
In reply to this post by linux
On Tue, 9 Apr 2019 23:23:54 +0200
<[hidden email]> wrote:

>Without doubts it should be 440 Hz +- 50 Cent.
>
>+- 50 Cents is what the meter of the BOSS TU-12H chromatic tuner
>displays and what you'll find for other software synth, such as e.g.
>iSymphonic. The BOSS meter's Hz labelling is from 430 Hz to 450 Hz and
>the Hz labelling of iSymphonic from 428 Hz to 452 Hz. IOW the
>Cent labelling range from - 50 Cent to + 50 Cent is a little bit more
>than the HZ labelling range from 428 Hz or 430 Hz to 450 Hz or 452 Hz.
>

Thanks everyone for your comments. There seems to be a general consensus (and
elsewhere too) so I'll check nobody actually *is* using extreme settings for
some reason, and maybe tame it down a bit.

As an aside, doing further reading it seems most authorities consider 5 cents to
be about the limit for people to detect pitch change (lots of caveats of
course) yet Scala example files have figures with 10^-6 cents, and Yoshimi
has 10^-6 :o

--
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... the hard part is not dodging what life throws at you,
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Re: 'A' note Tuning Range

Len Ovens
On Wed, 10 Apr 2019, Will J Godfrey wrote:

> On Tue, 9 Apr 2019 23:23:54 +0200
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Without doubts it should be 440 Hz +- 50 Cent.
>
> Thanks everyone for your comments. There seems to be a general consensus (and
> elsewhere too) so I'll check nobody actually *is* using extreme settings for
> some reason, and maybe tame it down a bit.

For tuning, anything greater than half way between semitones can be
acheived with transpose. Or, to put it another way, if you need to detune
by that much, you are really playing in a different key.

--
Len Ovens
www.ovenwerks.net
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Re: ?==?utf-8?q? 'A' note Tuning Range

Ralf Mattes
 
Am Mittwoch, 10. April 2019 18:38 CEST, Len Ovens <[hidden email]> schrieb:
 

> On Wed, 10 Apr 2019, Will J Godfrey wrote:
>
> > On Tue, 9 Apr 2019 23:23:54 +0200
> > <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> >> Without doubts it should be 440 Hz +- 50 Cent.
> >
> > Thanks everyone for your comments. There seems to be a general consensus (and
> > elsewhere too) so I'll check nobody actually *is* using extreme settings for
> > some reason, and maybe tame it down a bit.
>
> For tuning, anything greater than half way between semitones can be
> acheived with transpose. Or, to put it another way, if you need to detune
> by that much, you are really playing in a different key.

Hmm, no. You are mixing up frequency with pitch class. (Ab)using transposition for changing
pitch only works for equal temprament (but OP referes to Scala tunings).
Even in my rather limited world of baroque music playing I've used: 440, 415 (modern pseudo-baroque),
432, 392 (french low), 456 (high Venetian), 517 ...
That has nothing whatsoever todo with transposition.

Just my 0.2 $

 Cheers, RalfD


> --
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> www.ovenwerks.net
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Re: 'A' note Tuning Range

John Rigg-6
In reply to this post by Will Godfrey
On Tue, Apr 09, 2019 at 09:21:09PM +0100, Will Godfrey wrote:
> Currently in 'Scales' Yoshimi can set this anywhere between 1Hz and 2kHz, which
> is frankly ridiculous.
>
> This doesn't appear at all in the Scala documentation, so that's no guide.
>
> I've had suggestions ranging from +- 1/2 semitone to +- half octave as being
> more than enough, considering that there is also semitone master key shift
> covering +- 3 octaves (used to be 5!) along with a fine detune of +63 -64
> cents.

A Korg GA-1 tuner can go down to 5 semitones flat. It's quite common
in the heavier styles of rock music to downtune a few semitones.

John
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Re: 'A' note Tuning Range

Will Godfrey
On Thu, 11 Apr 2019 08:16:29 +0000
John Rigg <[hidden email]> wrote:

>On Tue, Apr 09, 2019 at 09:21:09PM +0100, Will Godfrey wrote:
>> Currently in 'Scales' Yoshimi can set this anywhere between 1Hz and 2kHz, which
>> is frankly ridiculous.
>>
>> This doesn't appear at all in the Scala documentation, so that's no guide.
>>
>> I've had suggestions ranging from +- 1/2 semitone to +- half octave as being
>> more than enough, considering that there is also semitone master key shift
>> covering +- 3 octaves (used to be 5!) along with a fine detune of +63 -64
>> cents.  
>
>A Korg GA-1 tuner can go down to 5 semitones flat. It's quite common
>in the heavier styles of rock music to downtune a few semitones.
>
>John

Interesting. Thanks for that.

--
It wasn't me! (Well actually, it probably was)

... the hard part is not dodging what life throws at you,
but trying to catch the good bits.
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Re: 'A' note Tuning Range

John Rigg-6
In reply to this post by Will Godfrey
On Thu, Apr 11, 2019 at 12:17:58PM +0200, [hidden email] wrote:

> On Thu, 2019-04-11 at 08:37 +0100, Will J Godfrey wrote:
> > On Thu, 11 Apr 2019 08:16:29 +0000
> > John Rigg <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > > A Korg GA-1 tuner can go down to 5 semitones flat. It's quite common
> > > in the heavier styles of rock music to downtune a few semitones.
> > Interesting. Thanks for that.
>
> Assuming the guitar tuner is a chromatic tuner, dropped and lowered
> guitar tunings don't require anything else than A = 440 Hz and if you
> dislike 440Hz a range from + half of a semitone (+50 cent) to - half of
> a semitone (-50 Cent).
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_guitar_tunings#Dropped
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_guitar_tunings#Lowered

That's all very well, but tuning quickly on stage in a live gig
is lot easier if your tuner goes down to the right pitch with
minimal fuss. (Speaking from long experience as gigging guitarist
and bassist).

The GA-1 tuner I mentioned isn't a true chromatic tuner, but
its ability to shift the standard guitar tunings down several
semitones is very useful. In modern metal genres C or B tunings
are probably more common than the standard EADGBE, so this isn't
just an edge case.

John
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