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USB MIDI controller

Will Godfrey
Can anyone recommend one of these that's reasonably small and robust - not
requiring a second mortgage!

I don't want keys, but programmable push buttons and sliders/knobs. A joystick
would be icing on the cake.

Thanks in advance.

Will.

--
Will J Godfrey
http://www.musically.me.uk
Say you have a poem and I have a tune.
Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.
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Re: USB MIDI controller

Robert Edge
I use a Behringer BCF2000 for my Pure Data instruments and like it just fine.  20 buttons, 8 knobs, 8 motorized faders.  It's got an expression pedal input as well.  It seems to be holding up alright, but it's a Behringer...

I just use a regular generic X-Box controller for joy sticks.

demo of my setup here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gaP5ckAQl0

On Sun, Dec 11, 2016 at 3:38 PM, Will Godfrey <[hidden email]> wrote:
Can anyone recommend one of these that's reasonably small and robust - not
requiring a second mortgage!

I don't want keys, but programmable push buttons and sliders/knobs. A joystick
would be icing on the cake.

Thanks in advance.

Will.

--
Will J Godfrey
http://www.musically.me.uk
Say you have a poem and I have a tune.
Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.
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Re: USB MIDI controller

Georg Krause
+1 for the bfc2k.

> but it's a Behringer...

It is. But in this case its not a big point, because there are no audio
quality issues or something like that. the midi signal has the same
quality, no matter where you save money. more important is: its class
compliant usb, its fully programmable, pretty robust (i dont have a
case, just put it in a bag to move it) and you can open it and adjust
the fader resistance ;)

the size may be a down side, but i can totally recommend it.


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Re: USB MIDI controller

Johannes Kroll
On Sun, 11 Dec 2016 22:29:53 +0100
Georg Krause <[hidden email]> wrote:

> +1 for the bfc2k.
>
>  [...]  
>
> more important is: its class
> compliant usb, its fully programmable,

About the programming/configuring: Does it work natively under Linux?

The Korg Nano 2 series is nice and really affordable. The NanoKey2's
piano keys are not great, but the nanoKONTROL2 is quite useful. Needs a
Windows app for configuring though, which works in WINE.
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Re: USB MIDI controller

Georg Krause
> About the programming/configuring: Does it work natively under Linux?

You can program all the stuff without any pc, just using the bcf2k. so
its os independent.


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Re: USB MIDI controller

Will Godfrey
In reply to this post by Georg Krause
On Sun, 11 Dec 2016 22:29:53 +0100
Georg Krause <[hidden email]> wrote:

> +1 for the bfc2k.
>
> > but it's a Behringer...  
>
> It is. But in this case its not a big point, because there are no audio
> quality issues or something like that. the midi signal has the same
> quality, no matter where you save money. more important is: its class
> compliant usb, its fully programmable, pretty robust (i dont have a
> case, just put it in a bag to move it) and you can open it and adjust
> the fader resistance ;)
>
> the size may be a down side, but i can totally recommend it.

This actually looks very attractive indeed. I found an old Sound On Sound
review of it and apparently you can get a Java application for programming it.
This is platform agnostic.

I think I'd be taking rather a risk trying to order one before Christmas now,
but I'll certainly be giving it serious consideration in January.

Thanks for such a quick response guys.

--
Will J Godfrey
http://www.musically.me.uk
Say you have a poem and I have a tune.
Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.
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Re: USB MIDI controller

laulau
Anyone ever tried stuff from this Icon company?
http://iconproaudio.com/product/platform-m/

its only slightly more expensive than the behringer BUT has motor faders...

December 11 2016 11:19 PM, "Will Godfrey" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Sun, 11 Dec 2016 22:29:53 +0100
> Georg Krause <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> +1 for the bfc2k.
>>
>>> but it's a Behringer...
>>
>> It is. But in this case its not a big point, because there are no audio
>> quality issues or something like that. the midi signal has the same
>> quality, no matter where you save money. more important is: its class
>> compliant usb, its fully programmable, pretty robust (i dont have a
>> case, just put it in a bag to move it) and you can open it and adjust
>> the fader resistance ;)
>>
>> the size may be a down side, but i can totally recommend it.
>
> This actually looks very attractive indeed. I found an old Sound On Sound
> review of it and apparently you can get a Java application for programming it.
> This is platform agnostic.
>
> I think I'd be taking rather a risk trying to order one before Christmas now,
> but I'll certainly be giving it serious consideration in January.
>
> Thanks for such a quick response guys.
>
> --
> Will J Godfrey
> http://www.musically.me.uk
> Say you have a poem and I have a tune.
> Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.
> _______________________________________________
> Linux-audio-user mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
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Re: USB MIDI controller

Georg Krause
The behringer also has ;)

Am So. Dez. 11 23:27:41 2016 GMT+0100 schrieb [hidden email]:

> Anyone ever tried stuff from this Icon company?
> http://iconproaudio.com/product/platform-m/
>
> its only slightly more expensive than the behringer BUT has motor faders...
>
> December 11 2016 11:19 PM, "Will Godfrey" <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > On Sun, 11 Dec 2016 22:29:53 +0100
> > Georg Krause <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> >> +1 for the bfc2k.
> >>
> >>> but it's a Behringer...
> >>
> >> It is. But in this case its not a big point, because there are no audio
> >> quality issues or something like that. the midi signal has the same
> >> quality, no matter where you save money. more important is: its class
> >> compliant usb, its fully programmable, pretty robust (i dont have a
> >> case, just put it in a bag to move it) and you can open it and adjust
> >> the fader resistance ;)
> >>
> >> the size may be a down side, but i can totally recommend it.
> >
> > This actually looks very attractive indeed. I found an old Sound On Sound
> > review of it and apparently you can get a Java application for programming it.
> > This is platform agnostic.
> >
> > I think I'd be taking rather a risk trying to order one before Christmas now,
> > but I'll certainly be giving it serious consideration in January.
> >
> > Thanks for such a quick response guys.
> >
> > --
> > Will J Godfrey
> > http://www.musically.me.uk
> > Say you have a poem and I have a tune.
> > Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.
> > _______________________________________________
> > Linux-audio-user mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
> _______________________________________________
> Linux-audio-user mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
>
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Re: USB MIDI controller

laulau
yeah, an omission / typo: the icon has _touch sensitive_ motorized faders, the behringer not. i find this to be quite if you are doing something in latch mode and dont want to wiggle the faders all the time to get keyframes recorded.

December 11 2016 11:52 PM, "Georg Krause" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> The behringer also has ;)
>
> Am So. Dez. 11 23:27:41 2016 GMT+0100 schrieb [hidden email]:
>
>> Anyone ever tried stuff from this Icon company?
>> http://iconproaudio.com/product/platform-m
>>
>> its only slightly more expensive than the behringer BUT has motor faders...
>>
>> December 11 2016 11:19 PM, "Will Godfrey" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> On Sun, 11 Dec 2016 22:29:53 +0100
>>> Georg Krause <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> +1 for the bfc2k.
>>>>
>>>>> but it's a Behringer...
>>>>
>>>> It is. But in this case its not a big point, because there are no audio
>>>> quality issues or something like that. the midi signal has the same
>>>> quality, no matter where you save money. more important is: its class
>>>> compliant usb, its fully programmable, pretty robust (i dont have a
>>>> case, just put it in a bag to move it) and you can open it and adjust
>>>> the fader resistance ;)
>>>>
>>>> the size may be a down side, but i can totally recommend it.
>>>
>>> This actually looks very attractive indeed. I found an old Sound On Sound
>>> review of it and apparently you can get a Java application for programming it.
>>> This is platform agnostic.
>>>
>>> I think I'd be taking rather a risk trying to order one before Christmas now,
>>> but I'll certainly be giving it serious consideration in January.
>>>
>>> Thanks for such a quick response guys.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Will J Godfrey
>>> http://www.musically.me.uk
>>> Say you have a poem and I have a tune.
>>> Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Linux-audio-user mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
>> _______________________________________________
>> Linux-audio-user mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
>
> _______________________________________________
> Linux-audio-user mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
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Re: USB MIDI controller

Maurizio Berti
Also the Launch Control series from Novation is quite interesting. I own an XL (which has 24 knobs, 8 faders and 16+8 buttons); while it is not programmable from Linux (yet), I started a project some months ago, which aims to use a program as a sort of "proxy": this means that you connect the Launch Control to my program, and then connect it to your software(s), instruments and so on, also allowing some advanced behavior over MIDI (multiple toggle states, trigger more than one button at a time...) and obviously led programming.
It might not seem very easy in the beginning, but once you've configured your templates, it's very useful, expecially in live.
If you are interested, I wrote a small post here (with some screenshots and explaination on how it works):

Cheers

2016-12-11 23:56 GMT+01:00 <[hidden email]>:
yeah, an omission / typo: the icon has _touch sensitive_ motorized faders, the behringer not. i find this to be quite if you are doing something in latch mode and dont want to wiggle the faders all the time to get keyframes recorded.

December 11 2016 11:52 PM, "Georg Krause" <[hidden email]> wrote:
> The behringer also has ;)
>
> Am So. Dez. 11 23:27:41 2016 GMT+0100 schrieb [hidden email]:
>
>> Anyone ever tried stuff from this Icon company?
>> http://iconproaudio.com/product/platform-m
>>
>> its only slightly more expensive than the behringer BUT has motor faders...
>>
>> December 11 2016 11:19 PM, "Will Godfrey" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> On Sun, 11 Dec 2016 22:29:53 +0100
>>> Georg Krause <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> +1 for the bfc2k.
>>>>
>>>>> but it's a Behringer...
>>>>
>>>> It is. But in this case its not a big point, because there are no audio
>>>> quality issues or something like that. the midi signal has the same
>>>> quality, no matter where you save money. more important is: its class
>>>> compliant usb, its fully programmable, pretty robust (i dont have a
>>>> case, just put it in a bag to move it) and you can open it and adjust
>>>> the fader resistance ;)
>>>>
>>>> the size may be a down side, but i can totally recommend it.
>>>
>>> This actually looks very attractive indeed. I found an old Sound On Sound
>>> review of it and apparently you can get a Java application for programming it.
>>> This is platform agnostic.
>>>
>>> I think I'd be taking rather a risk trying to order one before Christmas now,
>>> but I'll certainly be giving it serious consideration in January.
>>>
>>> Thanks for such a quick response guys.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Will J Godfrey
>>> http://www.musically.me.uk
>>> Say you have a poem and I have a tune.
>>> Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Linux-audio-user mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
>> _______________________________________________
>> Linux-audio-user mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
>
> _______________________________________________
> Linux-audio-user mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
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--
È difficile avere una convinzione precisa quando si parla delle ragioni del cuore. - "Sostiene Pereira", Antonio Tabucchi
http://www.jidesk.net

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Re: USB MIDI controller

J. C.
In reply to this post by Georg Krause
Dec 11 2016, Georg Krause has written:

>> About the programming/configuring: Does it work natively under Linux?
>
> You can program all the stuff without any pc, just using the bcf2k. so
> its os independent.
Or you can edit the SysEx files, the knobs and CCs are written in plain
text. I've seen one. You can open it in any good text editor, that
allows saving without document format changes and the like.

Best wishes,

Jeanette

--------
When you need someone, you just turn around and I will be there <3
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Re: USB MIDI controller + OT 14-bit question

termtech
In reply to this post by Will Godfrey
On Sunday, December 11, 2016 8:38:16 PM EST Will Godfrey wrote:
> Can anyone recommend one of these that's reasonably small and robust - not
> requiring a second mortgage!
>
> I don't want keys, but programmable push buttons and sliders/knobs. A
> joystick would be icing on the cake.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> Will.

Slightly off-topic question:

What controllers offer to manipulate 14-bit from one knob or slider,
 including 'amalgamated' controls (so-called 'high' and 'low' controllers)
 and 14-bit (N)RPN?
Custom High/Low sending order?
Redundant controller number and value optimization
 (skip it or force send always)?

They should of course have the ability to manipulate the high and low
 separately with two knobs or sliders.

Does anyone use such a single continuous 14-bit control?
Would you like to but can't find apps that accept some or all of them?

These things greatly affect some input controller work I'm doing in MusE.
If you have such controllers, let me know so I can pester you to test ;-)

Thanks.
Tim.

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Re: USB MIDI controller

Joe Hartley
In reply to this post by J. C.
On Mon, 12 Dec 2016 01:02:17 +0100 (CET)
"Jeanette C." <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Dec 11 2016, Georg Krause has written:
>
> >> About the programming/configuring: Does it work natively under Linux?
> >
> > You can program all the stuff without any pc, just using the bcf2k. so
> > its os independent.
> Or you can edit the SysEx files, the knobs and CCs are written in plain
> text. I've seen one. You can open it in any good text editor, that
> allows saving without document format changes and the like.

I actually wrote part of the Ardour manual in previous revisions in which
I go into loading a custom configuration and such.

These dyas I use my BCF2k in mackie mode, and it works great.  I love the
motorized faders and the tactile feeling when dialing in a mix.  I've
had mine for over a decade, and it still works perfectly.

--
======================================================================
       Joe Hartley - UNIX/network Consultant - [hidden email]
 Without deviation from the norm, "progress" is not possible. - FZappa
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Re: USB MIDI controller

michael noble-2
In reply to this post by laulau
Behringer also makes the x-touch now, which does have touch faders. It's more expensive than the BCF, but not quite second mortgage levels...

On Mon, Dec 12, 2016 at 7:56 AM, <[hidden email]> wrote:
yeah, an omission / typo: the icon has _touch sensitive_ motorized faders, the behringer not. i find this to be quite if you are doing something in latch mode and dont want to wiggle the faders all the time to get keyframes recorded.

December 11 2016 11:52 PM, "Georg Krause" <[hidden email]> wrote:
> The behringer also has ;)
>
> Am So. Dez. 11 23:27:41 2016 GMT+0100 schrieb [hidden email]:
>
>> Anyone ever tried stuff from this Icon company?
>> http://iconproaudio.com/product/platform-m
>>
>> its only slightly more expensive than the behringer BUT has motor faders...
>>
>> December 11 2016 11:19 PM, "Will Godfrey" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> On Sun, 11 Dec 2016 22:29:53 +0100
>>> Georg Krause <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> +1 for the bfc2k.
>>>>
>>>>> but it's a Behringer...
>>>>
>>>> It is. But in this case its not a big point, because there are no audio
>>>> quality issues or something like that. the midi signal has the same
>>>> quality, no matter where you save money. more important is: its class
>>>> compliant usb, its fully programmable, pretty robust (i dont have a
>>>> case, just put it in a bag to move it) and you can open it and adjust
>>>> the fader resistance ;)
>>>>
>>>> the size may be a down side, but i can totally recommend it.
>>>
>>> This actually looks very attractive indeed. I found an old Sound On Sound
>>> review of it and apparently you can get a Java application for programming it.
>>> This is platform agnostic.
>>>
>>> I think I'd be taking rather a risk trying to order one before Christmas now,
>>> but I'll certainly be giving it serious consideration in January.
>>>
>>> Thanks for such a quick response guys.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Will J Godfrey
>>> http://www.musically.me.uk
>>> Say you have a poem and I have a tune.
>>> Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Linux-audio-user mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
>> _______________________________________________
>> Linux-audio-user mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
>
> _______________________________________________
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> [hidden email]
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Re: USB MIDI controller + OT 14-bit question

Len Ovens
In reply to this post by termtech
On Sun, 11 Dec 2016, termtech wrote:

> Slightly off-topic question:
>
> What controllers offer to manipulate 14-bit from one knob or slider,
> including 'amalgamated' controls (so-called 'high' and 'low' controllers)
> and 14-bit (N)RPN?
> Custom High/Low sending order?
> Redundant controller number and value optimization
> (skip it or force send always)?

The controlers previously discussed (bcf2k and other MCP controllers)
probably come closest. The faders are 1024 (10bit) via pitch controls. The
smallest 4 bits are ignored. Which brings about the whole hi rez MIDI
control question. Even with 7 bit CCs it is quite easy to make a change
fast enough to skip many intermediate values. While it is still possible
to make a slow enough move to use all 10 bit on the mcp faders, they are
getting close to the limit of what the physical resistor/motor combination
can handle... and the receiving software still has to ramp from value to
value (same with a GUI slider) anyway. Otherwise there will be zipper
noise. So the question quickly becomes how many bits are noticable with
proper ramping. The only controller specs I have looked at with true high
res in the spec are some of the Yamaha mixer controllers which have some
controls with as high as 28 bits... if they are actually continuous or
just a way of sending bigger numbers I am not sure (I don't have one to
play with)

> They should of course have the ability to manipulate the high and low
> separately with two knobs or sliders.
>
> Does anyone use such a single continuous 14-bit control?
> Would you like to but can't find apps that accept some or all of them?
>
> These things greatly affect some input controller work I'm doing in MusE.
> If you have such controllers, let me know so I can pester you to test ;-)

You must have smoothing for anything MIDI. It is not woth sending 5 midi
values where the last one comes after 3 midi events after you want to send
the the 6th event. MIDI can only send about 1000 events per sec (10bits a
byte at 31k, 3bytes per event... so 4 events per nrpn would cut that in 4.
nrpns can be less if there is only one control being moved at a time. as
soon as more than one move at a time, all 4 bytes need to be sent. This is
why MCP uses pitch bends for hi rez control... but that limits you to 16
high rez controllers per midi port.

So any application that accepts MIDI CC control does smoothing. The
controller makers tend not to advertize the granularity of their controls
:) because they are selling them to PNP people who use a MAC because
(insert name of star here) does. All they are concerned about is that they
can plug it in and it works. Most of the controllers I can think of that
use hi rez info very much are OSC controllers and touch sensitive.

For testing purposes a midi to midi converter middleware may take any midi
controller and allow two CCs to do high/low byte work. 96 position
encoders are quite common, more so than 128 position encoders. Both are
cheap ($5 each or less). A 14 bit encoder is $40-$60 complete... the chip
inside being about $11 and the casing/bearing/etc making up the rest. The
seven bit encoder for $3 requires much more computer attention and pin
out. And cpu speed matters (remember this is a controller, no one wants to
spend an extra $1k for a super computer to run it... they are R-PI like
deals)

So there is not likely to be such controllers. It is possible that you
could create a map for a touch based controller (think android) that would
do what you want... but remeber your res in that case is based on the
resolution of the touch screen itself, even a controller boasting .001
kinds of movements is going to send a new value every touch pixel
movement. So you want a large touch screen :)

This has been much of my research in the past year and a half. It is not
just what the resolution of the controller is, but also how fast you can
detect change and send it... and how fast the receiver can deal with it. I
am quickly coming to the conclusion that even 8 or 9 bits is enough.

--
Len Ovens
www.ovenwerks.net

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Re: USB MIDI controller

Ralf Mardorf
In reply to this post by Georg Krause
On Sun, 11 Dec 2016 22:29:53 +0100, Georg Krause wrote:
>+1 for the bfc2k.
>
>> but it's a Behringer...  
>
>It is. But in this case its not a big point, because there are no audio
>quality issues or something like that.

Behringer audio quality usually is superb. I'm going to buy a new audio
device and most likely I will _not_ buy a Behringer, assuming Focusrite
or Presonus devices could be used without proprietary software, for
usage with Linux and iOS. It might be, that in this domain Behringer
offers better access, then Focusrite and Presonus do.

I own a lot of audio gear from Behringer and other vendors.
Behringer device's service durability is a PITA, at least, but this is
for sure, switching power supply capacitors will fail, because usually
they are undersized by voltage, an engineered failure point, it has
nothing to do with the capacitor myth. Build quality is a PITA,
sometimes you have to send gear back, directly after it was delivered.
Repairing Behringer gear is a PITA, since getting access to the boards
and after repair assembling the device is time consuming and annoying.
It's not just opening, repairing and closing. And most annoying,
handling most of the times renders gear useless. I own devices with
superb audio quality and superb effect algorithms, but quasi don't use
them, because when being creative, pushing button D, then A + C,
waiting until LED 3 slowly flashes and after that pushing button B,
before you could change a value by a stiff dial wheel is a no-go. Let
alone that you need to read the manual each time you want to use such a
device. Potentiometers, faders and knobs don't last for long. When they
claim, that Alps is used, than seemingly substandard goods from Alps.
The only reason to buy Behringer is the price, because I can't repeat
often enough, the audio quality of the hardware, as well as of the
software is very good, excepted of their _most_ cheapest mixers, but
even their still very cheap mixers have got a very good sound quality.

If I don't suffer from a shortage of money, I most of the times decided
against Behringer. Very seldom I decided to buy a Behringer device,
when money wasn't an issue.

In short, I'm not against Behringer, if I suffer from a shortage of
money and need something, Behringer IMO is a very good choice. Just be
aware, that you can't hand down Behringer gear to your grandchildren
and it might fail in the worst possible moment, something that happens
less often for expensive gear from other vendors. But then remember,
sometimes repairing gear could be done in a few minutes, while for
Behringer gear you most likely need a few hours to open and close the
device.

Regards,
Ralf
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Re: USB MIDI controller

Ralf Mardorf
In reply to this post by Johannes Kroll
On Sun, 11 Dec 2016 23:06:45 +0100, Johannes Kroll wrote:
>About the programming/configuring: Does it work natively under Linux?
>
>The Korg Nano 2 series is nice and really affordable. The NanoKey2's
>piano keys are not great, but the nanoKONTROL2 is quite useful. Needs a
>Windows app for configuring though, which works in WINE.

The old nanoKONTROL could be used with a Linux app, that unfortunately
can't save and load the settings. The old nanoKONTROL's Windows app
doesn't work when using wine. https://github.com/royvegard/Nano-Basket

Just in case the nanoKONTROL is a device everybody should own.
It's inexpensive and could be useful, but the OP perhaps wants
something more advanced ;).

Regards,
Ralf
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Re: USB MIDI controller

Ralf Mardorf
In reply to this post by Georg Krause
On Sun, 11 Dec 2016 23:08:47 +0100, Georg Krause wrote:
>> About the programming/configuring: Does it work natively under
>> Linux?  
>
>You can program all the stuff without any pc, just using the bcf2k. so
>its os independent.

In a reasonable way? I don't know this device, but my experiences with
handling Behringer devices is as already described.

Push button D, then A + C, wait until LED 3 slowly flashes and after
that push button B, before you could change a value and if you can't
remember such steps, read the manual each time you want to change a
value.

;)
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Re: USB MIDI controller

Ralf Mardorf
In reply to this post by Will Godfrey
>the midi signal has the same quality, no matter where you save money.

That's not true, the interpretation of MIDI signals could suffer from
bad designed MIDI interfaces much, e.g. in regards to the used
opto-coupler and the fine tuning, as well as they could cause ground
loops, but indeed, all Behringer devices I ever used, had MIDI
interfaces that worked without issues.
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Re: USB MIDI controller

Ralf Mardorf
In reply to this post by Will Godfrey
>>the midi signal has the same quality, no matter where you save money.
>
>That's not true, the interpretation of MIDI signals could suffer from
>bad designed MIDI interfaces much, e.g. in regards to the used
>opto-coupler and the fine tuning, as well as they could cause ground
>loops, but indeed, all Behringer devices I ever used, had MIDI
>interfaces that worked without issues.

Thinking about it, in regards to MIDI I perhaps just used one Behringer
device :D, so no plural, just singular.
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